An Interview with Elron Hubba...

*** Note: I (ckaun@ads.com) am not the author of this article, nor *** of previous postings concerning or mentioning Elron. I am posting *** for an acquaintance, who prefers to remain anonymous for the present *** time. I should have indicated this in the previous postings, but did *** not think to, since these were more in the nature of announcements.

"An Interview with Elron Hubbahubba" ********************* <name withheld for Internet distribution> ********************* <location witheld for Internet distribution> May 31, 1995

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I met Elron at his company's facilities. In the telephone conversation with
him in which he agreed to my interview, he indicated he would rather not
have the exact location indicated, that he was afraid it might attract the
wrong kind of attention.  Let's just say it's in the South somewhere.


I had thought maybe Elron's name was a DBA, perhaps a good 'ole boy's
gentle mocking of his culture, and was not prepared for what I saw
when I met him in person.  I took him to be of Polynesian descent.  He
is very large both in height and girth, reminding me of a sumo
wrestler, with brown skin and a large, round, open face.  He looks to
be in his early fifties.  His most striking feature is entirely
incongruous with the rest of his appearance - his hair is bright red,
in large amounts.  His hands were simply huge.  They swallowed mine
when we shook hands in introduction.  He was dressed informally, in
slacks and an open shirt.


He showed me into his office, which was sparely furnished with a desk, a 
couple chairs, and a few file cabinets, and the interview began.


Q:  First of all, you have quite an unusual name.  How did you come by it?
A:  It is the name my mother gave me, but why she called me that, I 
    don't know.  There is nothing like the word 'elron' in our language;
    and while repeating words to make new ones is fairly common, 'hubba'
    doesn't correspond to anything either.  But she always insisted that
    that's what my name was.  I don't know how it should be spelled, I just
    used that spelling when I filled out my papers.


Q:  You say 'our language'.  Where did you come from?
A:  I was born and raised on the atoll island of Gombin, in the
    Caroline island group in the Phillipine Sea.  Our language is
    the same as some of the surrounding islands, but I haven't really
    heard it outside of that area.


Q:  But you speak English very well.  How did you learn it?
A:  When I was about ten, before I became a man, a missionary lady
    came to Gombin and opened a school and a church and a clinic; and
    everybody learned to speak English, and to read and write and pray,
    and lots of other things.  She was a nice lady, the very first 
    white person I ever saw.  She helped me with everything.  I was
    going to be a priest, and she talked to people and got me into a
    seminary in Guam.


Q:  Forgive me for saying so, but I can't help noticing how red your
    hair is.  It seems so, um, unusual to me.
A:  [kind of slumping] Yes, and to others.  I guess I got it from my
    father, who I never met.  Certainly no one else on Gombin has red
    hair.  I used to get teased terribly.  I should dye it, I guess.
    I don't know why I never have.


Q:  You say the missionary lady was the first white person you ever 
    saw.  Didn't merchant ships or anything ever stop at Gombin?
A:  Not really.  Gombin doesn't have a port or anything.  It's surrounded
    by a coral reef, so big ships can't really get close.  But I know what
    you're thinking, so I'll tell you what I know.  Sometimes the men
    of Gombin, when they got together and had a little 'mali', would 
    talk about the time before I was born when many long boats passed
    Gombin going both North and South.  They say that during those times, 
    there would be lights and thunder out at sea, with no storm clouds to 
    make them, and sometimes bodies would wash ashore.


    Shortly after that time, a big boat came to Gombin, not 
    as big as the long boats, but still big compared to our canoes.  It
    was there one morning, in the lagoon.  I guess it came in at high
    tide and cleared the reef, or there was a low spot in it, or something.
    The men said they called the chief of this boat the 'cacaca', which means
    rooster, because he strutted and crowed like one, and he was white and 
    had a funny red thing on top of his head.  They used to laugh like
    crazy when they talked about him, and they never told me directly,
    but I gathered they were talking about his hair. Anyway, he was
    there at about the right time, and I think he might have been my father.
    Paternity was always kind of an ambiguous thing in Gombin, because
    the women were the ones that did things.  The missionary lady said
    we had a matriarchal society, I think that was the term, anyway.
    Oh, yes, I remember.  She called it 'an enlighted society, a matriarchy'.


Q:  Didn't your mother ever tell you who your father was?
A:  No, she died when I was about five, before I wondered about it enough
    to ask her.  And besides, most people on Gombin didn't really know who
    their father was, at least until the missionary lady came.


Q:  So how ...  
A:  Wait, I've got to tell you more. It's funny.  The men used to say
    that when they asked the cacaca why he was there, the cacaca said there
    was a big iron fish in our lagoon that he needed to kill.  The men
    told him he was crazy, that the lagoon was only 40 feet deep and very
    clear, and you could see to the bottom, and there was no big iron fish in
    it.  The cacaca said that his 'charms', which I understand now may have
    meant instruments, told him there was a big iron fish in the lagoon,
    and it must have buried itself in the bottom of the lagoon.  Anyway,
    the cacaca went back on this boat, and the boat began to throw barrels
    off, into the lagoon. Some of the barrels went into the lagoon and made 
    a whumping sound, and then many fish floated to the surface.  One of the
    barrels apparently made a hole in the reef, because the men say that
    afterwards the cold waters and the sharks came in from the ocean, and
    there were not enough fish in the lagoon to feed people.  Also, the
    big boat was able to go out without dragging more than a little,
    according to the men.


Q:  That's a funny story.  But how could the cacaca, as you called him, 
    tell you this when you spoke a different language?
A:  Oh, most men go off for a time to other places to work and things,
    and one of them must have learned enough of the cacaca's language to
    talk with him.  The men say there was lots of coming and going during
    those times.


Q:  So tell me how you got into Scientology and e-meters and
    everything.
A:  Well, I think I told you I went to a seminary.  After I left the
    seminary, I joined the merchant marines and ...


Q:  Wait, wait!  Why did you leave the seminary?  And why did you join
    the merchant marine?
A:  I grew to be a man at the seminary, and then I found out that they
    wanted people to be, um..., what is that word?  Chaste?  No.  Oh, yes!
    They wanted people to be celibate. Virgin and celibate. I didn't
    want to be celibate, and I especially didn't want to be a virgin.
    [his face took on an appearance of something between pain, astonishment,
    and horror at this point] All the men on Gombin told me that to be a
    real person, I needed to experience 'nakinuki'.  Nakinuki is good
    for you, and it's fun.  I didn't want to be celibate!  No, siree.
    No virginity for me!


Q:  [pause] And why did you join the merchant marine?
A:  Oh, it was a job, and they made it sound good.  They lied, of
    course.  I began to learn a lot about lies and liars then, between
    the seminary and the merchant marine.  Ah, but you asked how I came
    across Scientology, that's what we were talking about.


    Anyway, after visiting the four corners of the world on a merchant tub,
    I ended up in the Caribbean, and one day I got an order to drop off a
    case of rum at some American's boat that had come in that day. So I 
    was putting the rum in the captain's locker, and the captain came in,
    and he looked at me and laughed, and he said "so who set you on fire,
    wog?".  I knew he was talking about my hair, so I looked at him, and
    his hair was red too, and I said "maybe the same one that did you,
    Pops".  That took him back a bit, and I think if I hadn't been so
    large, he might have gotten nasty.  Instead, he asked me where I
    came from, and I told him from Gombin.  Then he began to get a
    little interested, and asked me some more questions, and I told
    him my story.  Anyway, it turned out that that was Mr. Hubbard, and
    he was very nice to me.  


    Later, when he was in Florida, he got in touch with me, and had me
    come visit him from time to time. Then later, when he went to
    California, he had me come out.  He tried to tell me about
    Scientology, and how to audit, and such, but I always was a little slow,
    and the way he talked about it was very confusing, so I didn't get
    very far.  Still, he was always nice, and he told me I was a "real
    son to him, not like the others".  I did work with some of the
    people in Florida, though, and I learned more, and they were always
    nice, and made me feel at home.  And that's how I got into, as you
    put it, Scientology.


Q:  From the way you describe it, your experience with Scientology was
    fairly casual. And yet, according to your press release, you've
    been investigating auditing and e-meters for the past ten years.
    The two don't really seem compatible.  How do you explain that?
A:  Well, there's a bit more to the story than I've had time to tell.
    First, I've been learning more all the time.  Mr. Hubbard's Florida
    people have been very nice and very patient with me.  And Mr. Hubbard
    helped me start up the company, and he set up a foundation that pays
    for our research in matters dealing with "Scientific Spiritual
    Technology".  That's what we do - research in scientfic spiritual 
    technology.  Mr. Hubbard was always very nice to me, although I don't
    know why.  He didn't seem to be as nice to most other people. One man
    in particular he always called "Miss Cabbage", and treated him 
    terrible.  Mr. Hubbard once told me that I would be his 'successor
    in the Source', but I haven't been able to figure out what that means.


Q:  But discovering entheta accumulation in e-meters is pretty heavy
    stuff.  How did you think to look into this?
A:  [smiling shyly]  Well, Mr. Hubbard told me never to say this, but
    he's dead now, so I guess it doesn't matter.  Mr. Hubbard told me
    that that's where I should focus the research, that he wouldn't pay
    for anything else.  So that's what we did.  By the way, I didn't 
    do the research myself, that's Guy's job.  Did you meet Guy?  Guy Wisp?
    He's the Director of Research.  You've got to meet him.  [calling loudly]
    GUY!  GUY!  WOULD YOU COME IN HERE?  Guy's the one that made the 
    discovery.  Guy's an expert on auditing.  [with a wry expression]
    He should be, he's addicted to it!  That's all he wants to do, is 
    audit.  He's an e-meter junkie.  He drives the staff crazy.  Do you
    know that one time we caught him auditing his wanker?


At first I was going to ask him what 'wanker' was in his language,
then I realized what he had said.  It was unprofessional to ask the
next question, but something in the incongruity of the situation
caused the question to tumble out before it could be stopped.


Q:  How in the world could he do that?
A:  I don't really know.  He said once said something about "if you can
    audit pets, you should be able to audit anything".  When we stumbled
    on him, he was in a storeroom.  He had the cans kind of tied around it, 
    with one on top, and one beneath, and a couple of pieces of rubber 
    bushing between the cans to keep them from touching each other.  He was
    standing there, holding the whole business in his hands, with the
    meter facing him on a table, shouting all sorts of crazy questions.
    It was a weird sight, I'll tell you.  [pause]  I know the problem, 
    though, it's no nakinuki.  He probably can't find nakinuki.  [with 
    a reflective expression, and a sigh] I can't find nakinuki, not
    like Gombin.  It takes good nakinuki to make you a real human being.


I suddenly realized with a start that there was another person in the room
with us.  How or when he came in I did not see.  He was shortish,
and extremely skinny, gaunt almost.  His arms, which protruded from a
white shirt with rolled up sleeves, looked like broomsticks in thickness.
His face reminded me of pictures I have seen of starving people.  His 
skin was tight and stretched on his features.  His cheeks protruded, his
black eyes stared from hollow sockets.  His hair was black, and straight, but 
thin.  His eyebrows were heavy and bushy and black.  His skin was pale gray,
almost white.  When he opened his mouth to speak, his teeth showed very yellow
and scraggly.  My skin crawled to look at him.


"Hi, I'm Guy Wisp", he said.  Elron introduced me.  When we shook hands, 
his touch was cold and clammy, and I didn't want to think about what he
might have recently had in them.  I did very much want to wash.


"Technology to save the universe", Guy said.  Then he was gone.  Like
the Cheshire cat, except there was no smile, he just kind of
disappeared.


"Don't mind Guy", Elron said, "He likes to be a little spooky, and he
does strange things."  


He paused, then continued, "One time a witch-doctor I knew in Jamaica
visited me.  When she saw him, she went white, and began to shake her
rattle at him, and wouldn't stop until he left.  Then she told me to
get rid of him, get away from him, anything, if I wanted to save
myself.  I laughed at her, and told her he wasn't really that bad.  'Yes',
she hissed at me, 'he isn't bad, and he isn't good.  He's not evil, he's
nothing. He's empty. He's got no soul.  Something has drained all life
from his spirit, and left him a vacuum, a black, empty hole that will
suck all life from anything it comes in contact with, or turn it to
dust.  Kill him if you can, run if you can't.  I'd do it myself, but
my spells work on the spirit, and he has none.'  Then she left, and
wouldn't come back, even though once we had been close friends.  I
never, ever saw her scared like that, and we did some pretty wild
things".


There was a long pause.  I suddenly felt disoriented, and confined in
this close room with no windows, and I couldn't think of how to
continue the interview, or how to end it.  Elron seemed deep in 
thought himself, possibly pondering the witch-doctor's comments,
or perhaps remembering doing 'wild things' with her.  Finally, Elron
stirred himself.


"Well," he said, "it's not the strangest thing I've ever heard of
being audited."  I understood the point of comparison to be Mr. Wisp's
wanker.  


Elron continued, "Mr. Hubbard told me he once audited a body
thetan."  Reason fled me. I gaped blankly.


"A big, black one.  Mr. Hubbard said that the bigger the lie, the more
mass they had.  He said he found one big enough, and substantial
enough, to stick on the meter.  He said he took it through Incident 1,
the original incident, and cleared it.  He said when he took it
through Incident 2, the one where Xenu blew up everyone on earth,
there was no response.  Nothing.  That body thetan wasn't in Incident 2.
But there was another incident involving other Marcabians, and this was one
of them."


Something was building in me, an enormous pressure.  I was going insane,
listening to this simple red-haired Polynesian calmly describing the 
auditing of a body thetan.  Once started, it went on and on, tumbling
out endlessly, like a waterfall, as if it had been dammed up for years
and needed to get itself out.


"Mr. Hubbard said that he determined by auditing the body thetan that
this other incident had destroyed all of the living planets, except
three, and one of them was Earth.  Mr. Hubbard said he it was going to
be impossible to save the world, even in a billion years. With only
three living planets left in the universe, and uncounted quadrillions of
body thetans from this other incident seeking attachment, once could
never clear oneself completely."


[I'm dying! I'm dying! Lord Jesus, save me, I'm dying! Gotta pray, 
 gotta pray. How does it go?  "Now I lay me down to sleep, I pray the
 Lord ...]


"But I've got an idea.  I don't have many ideas, but I think I've got
an idea.  I'll have to tell Guy about it.  We can capture the body
thetans in the new f*meter.  Guy told me we can reverse potential, and
flush them out of the f*meter.  We'll store them someplace, like they
did with the spooks in 'Ghostbusters'.  When we get enough of them
together, we'll do an incident on them, something like Incident 2 ..."


[Shrieeeeeeeekkk!!!]


Some time later, I found myself on the freeway, driving north at a
high rate of speed.  I have no idea how I got there.  I hope it had
nothing to do with Guy Wisp.  I hope I exteriorized or something.


I've got to think.  Where can I go to think?  I hope I didn't offend
Elron or anything.  He wasn't the brightest light, but he was decent,
and I liked him, and he certainly was a different interview.  I'll
have to call him when I've straightened things in my head out a bit,
and see if I can do another interview.  But nowhere near the dear Mr.
Wisp, that's for sure.


First, I've got to get this interview down on paper, and get the story
out.  Then we'll take it from there.  I'll be reporting what I find.


******************* <name deleted for Internet release>